Cons of Interchiller - In humid environments

[JBTRXNJ]

You running the IC chiller on the SS? No expansion/rezzy tank right? Are you running the 3-way bypass? If so, any chance you have P/Ns for the fittings/hoses/etc you used?

Hoping he is using the Rez tank, so he can solve my washer fluid issue

 

[scantone]

Who cares about ur humidity. If i end up pulling the trigger and things work out here in the steamy depths of hell, we know you'll be just fine in ur mid-Atlantic cool breeze island hahaha

Just do it you'll be fine. The benefits far outweigh the, yeah I got nothin.

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

Anyone know what to do with the chiller when ambient temps are 30 or less? Will the chiller come on if you run cabin heat?!

 

[scantone]

Anyone know what to do with the chiller when ambient temps are 30 or less? Will the chiller come on if you run cabin heat?!

If the ac compressors running the chillers on. Turn the ac off and heat on the chiller would be off. Anti freeze freezes well below 30 degrees so you'll be fine.

 

[Boosted]

Hoping he is using the Rez tank, so he can solve my washer fluid issue

Give me a measurement from the inboard side of the coolant reservoir to the stud that the windshield washer reservoir relocation bracket attaches to and I'll be able to tell you if the spacer kit we have will work.

 

[Boosted]

You running the IC chiller on the SS? No expansion/rezzy tank right? Are you running the 3-way bypass? If so, any chance you have P/Ns for the fittings/hoses/etc you used?

Yeah, no reservoir. Not needed for what I am doing with the Super Stock (drag racing). IC coolant temps are in the low to mid 30's while in the staging lanes, about 40 after the burnout and 70 at the end of the run. Cools back down to 40's by the time I get to the pits. Runs 45-55 on the street with spirited driving.

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

Yeah, no reservoir. Not needed for what I am doing with the Super Stock (drag racing). IC coolant temps are in the low to mid 30's while in the staging lanes, about 40 after the burnout and 70 at the end of the run. Cools back down to 40's by the time I get to the pits. Runs 45-55 on the street with spirited driving.

that's amazing. I run about 100-105 IC coolant temps just feathering it around town. Get that thing installed on the Rex Bill! I'm anxiously awaiting ur feedback on fitment!

 

[AZDinoPwr]

that's amazing. I run about 100-105 IC coolant temps just feathering it around town. Get that thing installed on the Rex Bill! I'm anxiously awaiting ur feedback on fitment!

I love the intechillers, have run two now on previous builds and plan to do another one since I’m spinning the blower harder. But I do hope you have your expectations set correctly for what it is going to give you. On a stock TRX in hot weather I would guess it’s 30-35 hp improvement (modded hellcats see 40-50 hp) which is a smidge more than the intake. Folks picking up 40-50 hp in a car that weighs half as much as the TRX is noticeable. Remember, IC temp change does not equal change in IAT. If the Ic temp goes from 100deg to 50deg then the most you would ever see a change in IATs is less than 25 deg.

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

I love the intechillers, have run two now on previous builds and plan to do another one since I’m spinning the blower harder. But I do hope you have your expectations set correctly for what it is going to give you. On a stock TRX in hot weather I would guess it’s 30-35 hp improvement (modded hellcats see 40-50 hp) which is a smidge more than the intake. Folks picking up 40-50 hp in a car that weighs half as much as the TRX is noticeable. Remember, IC temp change does not equal change in IAT. If the Ic temp goes from 100deg to 50deg then the most you would ever see a change in IATs is less than 25 deg.

roger that. I'm expecting the chiller to keep my system running cooler than the depths of hell so that when i give it the beans for a few seconds, it pulls like it normally would in 65-70 degree ambient temps, for example. Is that a fair expectation?

Stated otherwise, I want my truck to not run retarded 300 days of the year b/c it's as hot as satan's a-hole. Never a Dem but this summer has made me a believer in global heating lol.

 

[Al Bundy]

It would be cool to see some chiller data on an otherwise stock TRX.

 

[Boosted]

that's amazing. I run about 100-105 IC coolant temps just feathering it around town. Get that thing installed on the Rex Bill! I'm anxiously awaiting ur feedback on fitment!

My TRX is the same which is why we are installing one soon. Just waiting for Charlie to get over here. I already have all the prototype brackets ready to go.

Bill

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

Had a chance to speak with Charlie over at IC Chiller for nearly an hour earlier this week. Here's the IC Chiller scoop + Good news & bad news:

Bad news 1st: the IC chiller kit is NOT plug & play for our trucks. There are 2 splices (I believe he said) that have to be made into the soft/rubber lines (not hard to do but obviously permanent). In order to go back to stock, you'd have to buy another OEM AC line kit (prolly not a big deal but something to consider nonetheless).

Good news: that's how he saves you about $800+. His kit is $1500. Think competitor FI (cost is around $2400 w/no rezzy; $3100 with rezzy). Ripa is $3k with Rezzy/etc.

More good news (for humid environments): No lines freezing & no condensation dripping. His kit is not designed to freeze your AC lines like subzero from mortal kombat. It's designed to reduce IC coolant temps to the point where you can do a 1/3mi pass, for example, without any timing being pulled. By the end of the run you're probably around 80deg IC coolant temp but once you head back to the starting line, you're back around 35deg IC coolant temp (give or take). B/c things arent running as cold as competitors, the risk of condensation leaking into the cylinders is not there at shutdown. Dusterhoff/Barth/etc like when customers use his kit b/c they dont have to tune a fuel dump into the start-up to help with the condensation probs.

Other Points I took away from our convo:

• No issues offroading with chiller kit (rock crawling slow or high speed running).
• Lowest IC coolant temp I'll see in Fla = prolly around 35deg F
• About a 15 degree drop in IC coolant temp from chiller + cabin mode to "Drag mode" (i.e., chiller only)
• His kit can/will get down to 19deg but not really necessary
• He’s going to get me Part #s for everything needed to put the 3-way bypass kit together. This kit will allow you to stay plumbed back to the OEM heat exchanger and essentially not use the chiller.
  • He's going to look into whether the TRX heat exchanger is linked to the trans cooler; if so, we would need to run the 3-way bypass kit. I dont think Ripa offers a 3-way bypass so perhaps its not linked/necessary.
  • Only need 1 free Aux switch unless using the 3-way bypass (then 2 aux switches needed). He can supply a rocker switch in the kit if we dont have an Aux switch available.
  
  
• Rezzy tank is not really needed unless you're planning on doing multiple back to back passes with no time in between. I think for those of us who do a few occasional runs in Mexico with friends - by the time you line back up and talk 1 minute of shit, you're probably good to go.
• All hardware in his kit is lab tested & pressure tested well beyond our application(s) so failure more likely from the OEM AC fittings than the stuff he supplies

Key takeaway: Charlie seems like a stand-up guy. He was willing to stay on the phone with me for 3 hours if I had that many questions. He's willing to spend the time before the sale AND after the sale to make sure install goes smoothly and things are right. Reminds me a lot of @Boosted who was willing to help me after hours when I had Tazer issues/questions back in the day. Turns out they Charlie and Bill are actually friends so no wonder lol! Bill is running Charlie's chiller on his super stock and is going to be installing another chiller on his Rex hopefully by end of September. I will await their report on chiller install issues (if any) with Bill's behind the grill light setup and windshield rezzy relocation (since i have the same kit).

Hope this write-up gives some people answers they were looking for. I know which kit I'll be going with

 

[scantone]

More good news (for humid environments): No lines freezing & no condensation dripping. His kit is not designed to freeze your AC lines like subzero from mortal kombat. It's designed to reduce IC coolant temps to the point where you can do a 1/3mi pass, for example, without any timing being pulled. By the end of the run you're probably around 80deg IC coolant temp but once you head back to the starting line, you're back around 35deg IC coolant temp (give or take). B/c things arent running as cold as competitors, the risk of condensation leaking into the cylinders is not there at shutdown. Dusterhoff/Barth/etc like when customers use his kit b/c they dont have to tune a fuel dump into the start-up to help with the condensation probs.

This point doesn't make much sense to me................ My intercooler coolant has never gotten below 48 degrees and there's no doubt the intercooler bricks develop condensation it's unavoidable, hot and cold in a humid environment = condensation.

 

[JBTRXNJ]

I’m going to wait to see how it plays out for you guys, but I agree with @scantone if the dew point is 75 degrees, condensation will occur at any temp below that.

Interestingly, I read a thread on a Porsche forum, discussing intercooler efficiency in humid climates, and humid air makes them far more efficient due to the conductivity of the water vapor.

With that said, I was trying to read up on the issues at startup, and I haven’t been able to find much on it.

I’ve been thinking about this a lot though, and perhaps @AZDinoPwr or one of the other folks that is much smarter than I am can help explain, if the combustion chamber is 1000+ degrees during combustion, and the engine block runs temps between 190 and 220 (as a whole), how is this an issue, shouldn’t the condensation vaporize as soon as it enters the chamber? Even at extraordinarily high humidity, is there really enough water in whatever volume of air has passed through the intercooler but not been drawn into the motor, to produce this issue?

Not trying to be argumentative, really just curious.

 

[AZDinoPwr]

I’m going to wait to see how it plays out for you guys, but I agree with @scantone if the dew point is 75 degrees, condensation will occur at any temp below that.

Interestingly, I read a thread on a Porsche forum, discussing intercooler efficiency in humid climates, and humid air makes them far more efficient due to the conductivity of the water vapor.

With that said, I was trying to read up on the issues at startup, and I haven’t been able to find much on it.

I’ve been thinking about this a lot though, and perhaps @AZDinoPwr or one of the other folks that is much smarter than I am can help explain, if the combustion chamber is 1000+ degrees during combustion, and the engine block runs temps between 190 and 220 (as a whole), how is this an issue, shouldn’t the condensation vaporize as soon as it enters the chamber? Even at extraordinarily high humidity, is there really enough water in whatever volume of air has passed through the intercooler but not been drawn into the motor, to produce this issue?

Not trying to be argumentative, really just curious.

From my experience and the others on this forum I have discussed with, the condensation issue only occurs during a specific time window after shutdown. During roughly hours 1-3 after shutdown the motor has cooled enough not to vaporize any condensation but not enough time has elapsed for evaporation to occur. Therefore, condensation drips down and actually sits on top of the intake valves and puddles there.

 

[AZDinoPwr]

Had a chance to speak with Charlie over at IC Chiller for nearly an hour earlier this week. Here's the IC Chiller scoop + Good news & bad news:

Bad news 1st: the IC chiller kit is NOT plug & play for our trucks. There are 2 splices (I believe he said) that have to be made into the soft/rubber lines (not hard to do but obviously permanent). In order to go back to stock, you'd have to buy another OEM AC line kit (prolly not a big deal but something to consider nonetheless).

Good news: that's how he saves you about $800+. His kit is $1500. Think competitor FI (cost is around $2400 w/no rezzy; $3100 with rezzy). Ripa is $3k with Rezzy/etc.

More good news (for humid environments): No lines freezing & no condensation dripping. His kit is not designed to freeze your AC lines like subzero from mortal kombat. It's designed to reduce IC coolant temps to the point where you can do a 1/3mi pass, for example, without any timing being pulled. By the end of the run you're probably around 80deg IC coolant temp but once you head back to the starting line, you're back around 35deg IC coolant temp (give or take). B/c things arent running as cold as competitors, the risk of condensation leaking into the cylinders is not there at shutdown. Dusterhoff/Barth/etc like when customers use his kit b/c they dont have to tune a fuel dump into the start-up to help with the condensation probs.

Other Points I took away from our convo:

• No issues offroading with chiller kit (rock crawling slow or high speed running).
• Lowest IC coolant temp I'll see in Fla = prolly around 35deg F
• About a 15 degree drop in IC coolant temp from chiller + cabin mode to "Drag mode" (i.e., chiller only)
• His kit can/will get down to 19deg but not really necessary
• He’s going to get me Part #s for everything needed to put the 3-way bypass kit together. This kit will allow you to stay plumbed back to the OEM heat exchanger and essentially not use the chiller.
  • He's going to look into whether the TRX heat exchanger is linked to the trans cooler; if so, we would need to run the 3-way bypass kit. I dont think Ripa offers a 3-way bypass so perhaps its not linked/necessary.
  • Only need 1 free Aux switch unless using the 3-way bypass (then 2 aux switches needed). He can supply a rocker switch in the kit if we dont have an Aux switch available.
  
  
• Rezzy tank is not really needed unless you're planning on doing multiple back to back passes with no time in between. I think for those of us who do a few occasional runs in Mexico with friends - by the time you line back up and talk 1 minute of shit, you're probably good to go.
• All hardware in his kit is lab tested & pressure tested well beyond our application(s) so failure more likely from the OEM AC fittings than the stuff he supplies

Key takeaway: Charlie seems like a stand-up guy. He was willing to stay on the phone with me for 3 hours if I had that many questions. He's willing to spend the time before the sale AND after the sale to make sure install goes smoothly and things are right. Reminds me a lot of @Boosted who was willing to help me after hours when I had Tazer issues/questions back in the day. Turns out they Charlie and Bill are actually friends so no wonder lol! Bill is running Charlie's chiller on his super stock and is going to be installing another chiller on his Rex hopefully by end of September. I will await their report on chiller install issues (if any) with Bill's behind the grill light setup and windshield rezzy relocation (since i have the same kit).

Hope this write-up gives some people answers they were looking for. I know which kit I'll be going with

Not trying to debate but just some food for thought… maybe if the IC chiller performance isn’t as good as FI then that is one of the kits the guy from FI was talking about that uses inferior components from beer chillers? Makes me worry about internal hardware quality a bit. Also FI runs deals quarterly or maybe more. Last year they had an end of year sale and the TRX plug and play kit was $1600. Just sign up for their emails.

 

[JBTRXNJ]

From my experience and the others on this forum I have discussed with, the condensation issue only occurs during a specific time window after shutdown. During roughly hours 1-3 after shutdown the motor has cooled enough not to vaporize any condensation but not enough time has elapsed for evaporation to occur. Therefore, condensation drips down and actually sits on top of the intake valves and puddles there.

What I’m struggling with (and in full transparency, this is just one of those nagging questions in my head) is that 1-3 hours after shut down, there is no new air being pulled in through the intake, wouldn’t that moisture have already cleared?

I guess 1 cc of water would be enough to make this an issue… if we are talking about condensation upstream in the line simply dripping down to the valves.

 

[JBTRXNJ]

What I’m struggling with (and in full transparency, this is just one of those nagging questions in my head) is that 1-3 hours after shut down, there is no new air being pulled in through the intake, wouldn’t that moisture have already cleared?

I guess 1 cc of water would be enough to make this an issue… if we are talking about condensation upstream in the line simply dripping down to the valves.

Is there a way to drain the condensate the way a catch can works?

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

What I’m struggling with (and in full transparency, this is just one of those nagging questions in my head) is that 1-3 hours after shut down, there is no new air being pulled in through the intake, wouldn’t that moisture have already cleared?

I guess 1 cc of water would be enough to make this an issue… if we are talking about condensation upstream in the line simply dripping down to the valves.

So I asked Kirk about this and he said the window is 45mins - 2hours after shut down. Here are his exact words:

The condensation unless tuned out or removed can and does cause hesitation when starting between 45min and 2hrs after shut down. Between 0-45min the condensation doesn’t fall enough. After 2hrs it has evaporated.

Firstly we recommend the tuner simply add more fuel to the hot start table this dilutes the condensation and the issue is resolved.

Or, you can turn the AC off 2min before home, the give it a little rev. Or simply give it a little rev and key off at 3000-4000rpm

What happens here is you blow it clear of anything and since the throttle body is closed no new air will enter and form condensation.

Or lastly place the intercooler pump on a switch.

 

[FULLTHROTTLERICK]

Not trying to debate but just some food for thought… maybe if the IC chiller performance isn’t as good as FI then that is one of the kits the guy from FI was talking about that uses inferior components from beer chillers? Makes me worry about internal hardware quality a bit. Also FI runs deals quarterly or maybe more. Last year they had an end of year sale and the TRX plug and play kit was $1600. Just sign up for their emails.

No I appreciate your input as you may very well be correct about the beer chiller. Bonus of that being true is i'd have another place to keep my beer cold (but not frozen) haha

So right now Kirk's kit is $2426 shipped. I found a 10% coupon code but not getting anywhere near $1600. That would have to be about 35% off sale. You sure that wasnt a few years ago (like before FI offered a true plug & play?)