Lemon Law Claim - Go with NCDS (arbitration) or get a lawyer

[DrKid]

Based a plain reading of each state’s law, Idaho seems to be your only choice. Sue Ram there and put the burden on it to make the jurisdiction/venue argument.

Thank you - I'm trying to go into this with open eyes and started the process trying to avoid legal involvement as I've heard if they really drag their feet Lemon Law cases can take 9 months - and I fear the TRX and the Supercharged V8 might be done by that time (or hell they might have a Red Eye ready by the and then f -it I'm in for that for sure)

However, the longer RAM drags this out the more I want to have the legal system bend them over.

CA Lemon Law is better for the customer - the car was paid for in Idaho but never registered there, and in fact at delivery the dealership collected CA State Sales tax and the vehicle was registered in CA upon arrival.

Also, the only way a Lemon Law buy back is better for me financially is I get to replace the truck with a significantly below MSRP vehicle purchased from one of the dealers posting threads here - if those deals still exist once the lemon law case is resolved.
My hope was that RAM would see the benefit of fast tracking a CDI for me so that the existing truck wouldn't get a residual value ding by being branded a lemon and I could get a CDI at Employee Pricing which would give me equivalent value to a $10k below MSRP but have the advantage of having the sale take place in California (no shipping, better protections) and hopefully at a faster pace.

Anyone who knows this stuff back and forth can check my math to see if the math I'm basing my decision matrix on is incorrect - if the Lemon Law path would net a much better financial position then I'd definitely be down with that -

Priorities in descending order
1. New Truck ASAP
2. Lowest out of pocket
3. CA purchase
4. Screw RAM (though this is moving up the order)

 

[DrKid]

Lawyer up asap. Have lawyer shove this nonsense down their throats. I bet a couple letters and this is solved. They are trying to punk you like a rube in from the farm thats never seen the big city

Thanks Bambi -
Unfortunately I'm a Rube from the city who was trusting that RAM/Stellantis actually wants to provide good customer care - but I do have the resources and hold a grudge enough to go out of pocket to make them hurt if they don't make it right ASAP.
I just want to rip this f-ing truck off road in Ocotillo with my kids this winter and it looks like RAM is screwing that plan whichever way I go.

 

[Claasicdrive]

I do think the lemon law is saying you can file in the state where you purchase the car not where you registered it.

 

[Bambi]

Thanks Bambi -
Unfortunately I'm a Rube from the city who was trusting that RAM/Stellantis actually wants to provide good customer care - but I do have the resources and hold a grudge enough to go out of pocket to make them hurt if they don't make it right ASAP.
I just want to rip this f-ing truck off road in Ocotillo with my kids this winter and it looks like RAM is screwing that plan whichever way I go.

Wasn’t calling you a rube. I’ve just developed a strong distrust of dealerships in general. I’d go with @Termite suggestion. File in either both jurisdictions or whichever is better for you and make them fight it

 

[Claasicdrive]

I gotta read the damn thread but there's a youtuber that got buyback, lemon law denied because he had....37' on the Raptor.
Not sure what your issue is and if you had 37' ( seen you mentioning a 37 thread) but if anything is suspension, driving shaft ,shocks your 37's invalidated the claim . He was in CA
His name is keepitdirty , the channel is an off road channel

 

[DrKid]

Wasn’t calling you a rube. I’ve just developed a strong distrust of dealerships in general. I’d go with @Termite suggestion. File in either both jurisdictions or whichever is better for you and make them fight it

No worries - I know you weren't calling me out, and my skins not THAT thin anyway - but damn it I just want a business to take PRIDE in their product and take care of the customers that spent 8 months post deposit waiting for it -

 

[buffguy52]

My arbitration date with Chrysler about mine is set for November 15th. I’ll let you know what comes of that.

 

[DrKid]

Thank you - I appreciate the update and I would love to hear what they say - can't believe you have to wait another 20 days - when did you start the process?

 

[DrKid]

So fears confirmed - any CDI offered could not be used to replace my TRX - crazy
Replacement of collateral - seems like no gain for me vs lemon law but only gain for RAM as they can avoid a LEMON LAW tag on the trucks VIN
$8k in “goodwill” but have to 1. Get my truck fixed and then I am subject to trade in value of TRX - so at dealers mercy on value - which if they low ball could erase any goodwill
Don’t know why they could not give me goodwill and a replacement of collateral - they win by not getting truck tagged as LEMON and I win with a discount on a 2022
Baring any great wisdom from this group it seems no benefit to take any of their offers as the net to me is the same as a lemon law buy back and they are the only ones that benefit by avoiding getting the truck tagged as a lemon.

From RAM:

Thank you for your email. Per our earlier conversation regarding the CDI certificate (Certified Designated Individual) I did find out that the 2021 and 2022 models of the RAM TRX are not eligible for redemption of the CDI certificate at this time. We apologize for the misinformation that may have been provided to you.

Now that we have that information, we have a few available options to move this case forward.

The first available option is a proactive repurchase or replacement of your vehicle. A repurchase would buy the vehicle back from you per your state guidelines and relieve you of your financial obligations to the vehicle. You would then be able to work with the dealer to purchase a new vehicle of your choosing. A replacement would be a substitute of collateral using your existing financing however, a replacement is dependent on lender/dealer concurrence and you would be responsible for any MSRP difference in the vehicles

The second available option would be, if you wish to keep the vehicle once the repairs are completed, I am approved to offer you $8,000 in goodwill compensation that, if you choose, you can use toward trading in the vehicle for the 2022 that you have ordered.

Alternatively, you can choose to not accept any of these available offers at which point I would notate your case and close it, referring you to continue working with the dealer for repairs. It is your right as a consumer to engage with and proceed with a lawyer if you see fit, but the steps that would be followed in that type of repurchase, are exactly the same as the repurchase steps that we are offering to you now.

Please advise how you would like me to proceed.

 

[Claasicdrive]

They'll buy it from you or give you 8k if you keep it after it gets fixed. What more do you expect to get ? It will show as buy back aka lemon if they buy it from you .Replacement is optional and is costing manufacturer more since they have to pay license, registration and other fees.

 

[Hello4x]

Why not just keep it, let them repair and take the $8k for a family vacation for all the time and stress you out into this.

 

[Johnkn]

CAN the dealer repair the truck? How many times have they unsuccessfully attempted the repair to date? Good luck

 

[DrKid]

Why not just keep it, let them repair and take the $8k for a family vacation for all the time and stress you out into this.

EDITED:
The customer service just sent an email clarifying that the check can be used for anything - but I’m guessing I sign something to accept it - and the devil will be in the details

 

[DrKid]

CAN the dealer repair the truck? How many times have they unsuccessfully attempted the repair to date? Good luck

Truck has been in 4 times for same 2 issues with a suspension fault - total of almost 70 days now - on this last visit it has been sitting at the dealer since September 7th.
So I have no idea if they can fix it - such a crazy situation

 

[Austinmtlhd]

I have chronicled my issue on the 37" tire thread - shockingly my truck has been at the dealer now for 28 straight days for a simple suspension fault - and this is the 4th time it has been at the dealer (total of almost 2 months in service on a 6 month old truck - @RamCares has not been able to push the needle to get the truck fixed. I own the truck in California but purchased in Idaho - I spoke with a California Lemon Law Attorney (thank you for the recommendations from this group) but he stated that because the truck was purchased in Idaho I need to find an Idaho attorney. The dealership says to just call the National Center for Dispute Settlement, LLC (NCDS) from the MOPAR website -

Is there an advantage to going with the lawyer in Idaho, or do they just complicate what should be an open and shut lemon law case that is going to go through arbitration anyway?

I LOVE the truck - but it drives me crazy in a $100k truck to have a sensor go off every time I drive it, and further concerns me that between @RamCares and the Dealer and Stellantis they have no idea what is wrong or how to fix it. The local dealer has said they will sell me a new truck at MSRP (but now I don't even know if that is a great deal with all of the below MSRP deals coming through)

Anyone also know - if I order a new truck - if I get a new order and it goes into D status am I certain to at least GET a new truck?

Thanks for any insight and advice.

The jury's still out on mine. Flooded passenger side and now drivers side with AC condensation. Chrysler not returning calls. I'm with ya, 100k and no truck for 25% of the time. Payments still but no truck. State of TX giving Chrysler till 11-24-21 to reply. Letters sent phone calls made paperwork gathered up. Everything but Chrysler fessing up to a bad build.

 

[DrKid]

The jury's still out on mine. Flooded passenger side and now drivers side with AC condensation. Chrysler not returning calls. I'm with ya, 100k and no truck for 25% of the time. Payments still but no truck. State of TX giving Chrysler till 11-24-21 to reply. Letters sent phone calls made paperwork gathered up. Everything but Chrysler fessing up to a bad build.

Bummer - sorry to hear about your troubles as well -
Stellantis finally found a part (PCM) that they say may fix my issue. Now on day 83? F@ck I don't know - might have lost count.
Dealer will install this part in the next week and then let me know if it actually fixes the issue - in which case - why did it take 83 days to send a part to fix the problem - They have had it since Sept 7th this time and no progress was made for 7 weeks until they ordered a part last week - I'm sure it is part shortage combined with production shortage combined with proprietary suspension system and needing computer nerds (not derogatory - I love me some nerds to make all the computer sh!t work) to fix the computer controlled suspension.

Dealer offered my $86,000 for my trade in (if it is fixed) of a $100,000k truck that has 7000 miles - that with the $8k of "goodwill" gets me back to MSRP on another truck - but I have to check the details on taxes etc etc.
Sounds like it might be better to lemon it - get ALL my money back minus $1,600 of use and then just buy the new truck at MSRP.

 

[Austinmtlhd]

Bummer - sorry to hear about your troubles as well -
Stellantis finally found a part (PCM) that they say may fix my issue. Now on day 83? F@ck I don't know - might have lost count.
Dealer will install this part in the next week and then let me know if it actually fixes the issue - in which case - why did it take 83 days to send a part to fix the problem - They have had it since Sept 7th this time and no progress was made for 7 weeks until they ordered a part last week - I'm sure it is part shortage combined with production shortage combined with proprietary suspension system and needing computer nerds (not derogatory - I love me some nerds to make all the computer sh!t work) to fix the computer controlled suspension.

Dealer offered my $86,000 for my trade in (if it is fixed) of a $100,000k truck that has 7000 miles - that with the $8k of "goodwill" gets me back to MSRP on another truck - but I have to check the details on taxes etc etc.
Sounds like it might be better to lemon it - get ALL my money back minus $1,600 of use and then just buy the new truck at MSRP.

That's my plan too. TX DMV saying due to shortages I'm probably not getting a new truck in trade. If Chrysler low balls me on buyback I'll just have them "fix" it again and sell it myself for 100K. They spent around 10k last time replacing interior. It will have to be done again. So they are out 20K in repairs. I'd feel sorry for them but they are shooting themselves in the foot.

 

[TRXDAVE]

EDITED:
The customer service just sent an email clarifying that the check can be used for anything - but I’m guessing I sign something to accept it - and the devil will be in the details

Did you ever get the details on this? I am curious if you accept the money then you can not pursue lemon law if you encounter the same issue down the line.

 

[DrKid]

Update -
RAM offered me the California equivalent of the Lemon Law Buyback - so roughly 97% of my money back as the problem arose before 4000 miles (actually at 2000 miles but did not have time to be without a vehicle and dealership did not offer loaner - and if you accept loaner it can affect your lemon law buyback status - so read up on rules).

Not terrible - what I did lose was the almost $6k in PPF and Tint (no offer to refund that).

So with MSRP increase and loss of PPF Tint it should cost me close to $10k out of pocket to change over truck - in return I get UConnect5 and I did select a few options on new truck that I wish I had picked first time around (carbon fiber) but did not include that in increased cost to replace calculations cited above.

Interestingly they said that I could drive the truck until the refund check arrived with no penalty (as long as it remained in current condition besides miles). So drove to dealer to pick up the truck as the dealership said it had finally and successfully repaired the issue - for other with service suspension fault light they had to replace the PCM (Powertrain Control Module)- then CURVEBALL - as they go to get my truck the mechanic comes out and says it has a REAR MAIN SEAL leak and parts are on order - two more weeks until my (or really RAMs truck now) is repaired. FACEPALM. Hopefully all my RAM ownership gremlins are worked out on this truck and the '22 I have incoming to replace it is free of issues.

 

[PabloK]

So fears confirmed - any CDI offered could not be used to replace my TRX - crazy
Replacement of collateral - seems like no gain for me vs lemon law but only gain for RAM as they can avoid a LEMON LAW tag on the trucks VIN
$8k in “goodwill” but have to 1. Get my truck fixed and then I am subject to trade in value of TRX - so at dealers mercy on value - which if they low ball could erase any goodwill
Don’t know why they could not give me goodwill and a replacement of collateral - they win by not getting truck tagged as LEMON and I win with a discount on a 2022
Baring any great wisdom from this group it seems no benefit to take any of their offers as the net to me is the same as a lemon law buy back and they are the only ones that benefit by avoiding getting the truck tagged as a lemon.

From RAM:

Thank you for your email. Per our earlier conversation regarding the CDI certificate (Certified Designated Individual) I did find out that the 2021 and 2022 models of the RAM TRX are not eligible for redemption of the CDI certificate at this time. We apologize for the misinformation that may have been provided to you.

Now that we have that information, we have a few available options to move this case forward.

The first available option is a proactive repurchase or replacement of your vehicle. A repurchase would buy the vehicle back from you per your state guidelines and relieve you of your financial obligations to the vehicle. You would then be able to work with the dealer to purchase a new vehicle of your choosing. A replacement would be a substitute of collateral using your existing financing however, a replacement is dependent on lender/dealer concurrence and you would be responsible for any MSRP difference in the vehicles

The second available option would be, if you wish to keep the vehicle once the repairs are completed, I am approved to offer you $8,000 in goodwill compensation that, if you choose, you can use toward trading in the vehicle for the 2022 that you have ordered.

Alternatively, you can choose to not accept any of these available offers at which point I would notate your case and close it, referring you to continue working with the dealer for repairs. It is your right as a consumer to engage with and proceed with a lawyer if you see fit, but the steps that would be followed in that type of repurchase, are exactly the same as the repurchase steps that we are offering to you now.

Please advise how you would like me to proceed.

Haven’t read all the posts but for sure get a lawyer.

I lemoned my 2017 SRT. Funny, FCA’s first offer was 8k. My lawyer pushed and they bought it back for purchase price and I had 40k on it.

Lawyer up!