Fifth Wheel

[Futant]

What would the tongue weight be with the load distributing hitch? I can’t remember what it’s called.

 

[tkdr6]

What would the tongue weight be with the load distributing hitch? I can’t remember what it’s called.

The only way to know how much the standard tongue weight decreases by using a weight distribution hitch is by weighing your axles.

Here is a really good video that walks through this and shows how tongue weight get's reduced by redistributing tongue weight back over the axles of the trailer:

It's actually surprising and on a truck like the TRX with limited available payload, using a weight distribution hitch is a great idea plus the additional safety factors (limit trailer sway, improve towing stability, etc.)

 

[tripleB]

Load distribution, or more commonly called a weight distribution hitch (WDH) does reduce tongue weight, but only by distributing it more evenly to all axles of the truck/trailer and relieving the burden from the hitch itself. So the weight is still part of the payload of the truck and doesn't change what the truck is rated to tow at all but they can definitely help make a larger trailer much safer to use. I use one on my RV every time it leaves town, if I'm just moving it around town the time require to put the WDH on isn't worth it.

To specifically answer your question though, there isn't an exact number as the hitch can be adjusted to shift varying amounts of weight to the front of the truck and to the rear of the trailer. I can adjust my WDH to the point that I can lift the back axle of truck off the ground which is very counter intuitive at first. The ideal setting is when the truck sits level so that you have proper and safe breaking and steering on the front axle.

 

[MAXGroup]

Load distribution, or more commonly called a weight distribution hitch (WDH) does reduce tongue weight, but only by distributing it more evenly to all axles of the truck/trailer and relieving the burden from the hitch itself. So the weight is still part of the payload of the truck and doesn't change what the truck is rated to tow at all but they can definitely help make a larger trailer much safer to use. I use one on my RV every time it leaves town, if I'm just moving it around town the time require to put the WDH on isn't worth it.

To specifically answer your question though, there isn't an exact number as the hitch can be adjusted to shift varying amounts of weight to the front of the truck and to the rear of the trailer. I can adjust my WDH to the point that I can lift the back axle of truck off the ground which is very counter intuitive at first. The ideal setting is when the truck sits level so that you have proper and safe breaking and steering on the front axle.

This is a very good explanation. Any part of the tongue weight that goes back to the trailer axles increases you net payload, as that weight was already accounted for in the gross trailer weight.
I think in the TRX this would be something that anyone that tows anything large should consider, with the 8500lb trailer weight you can tow some serious trailers, however the 900-1100lb payload of a fully loaded truck is a problem on family trips. Adjusting the tongue weight to 300-400lb will allow you to both tow and have your family on board.
I guess that without investing too much in weights and measurement equipment, just putting 300lb on the back of the bed and measuring the rake should give you a ball park of where you should be with a properly loaded trailer using a simple measuring tape.
My assumption that at 300 lb on the back in a real weight distribution scenario, at least 100-150 lb are transferred to the front axle.

This is not to replace getting the truck level with the trailer, this is just to have a lower height limit to start the fine tuning.

 

[tkdr6]

This is a very good explanation. Any part of the tongue weight that goes back to the trailer axles increases you net payload, as that weight was already accounted for in the gross trailer weight.
I think in the TRX this would be something that anyone that tows anything large should consider, with the 8500lb trailer weight you can tow some serious trailers, however the 900-1100lb payload of a fully loaded truck is a problem on family trips. Adjusting the tongue weight to 300-400lb will allow you to both tow and have your family on board.
I guess that without investing too much in weights and measurement equipment, just putting 300lb on the back of the bed and measuring the rake should give you a ball park of where you should be with a properly loaded trailer using a simple measuring tape.
My assumption that at 300 lb on the back in a real weight distribution scenario, at least 100-150 lb are transferred to the front axle.

This is not to replace getting the truck level with the trailer, this is just to have a lower height limit to start the fine tuning.

I've done that exact measuring method many of times and it's probably relatively close especially when using common sense. However, here in Colorado you can go to several places where they have electronic scales that can measure your truck axles and trailer axles so you can get exact measurements if you want it. No need for expensive equipment, it's like $25 to get an official weight measurement.

Not sure how easy it is for other states to get axle weight measurements, but for the OCD folks out there it's an easy/quick option to get exact numbers if you can get access to scales.

I've had my trailer tongue weight measured several times, here is what I got for my setup:
- 6,000 lbs camper dry weight = 605 lbs tongue weight
- 7,000 lbs camper loaded weight (water, clothes, food, etc.) = 708 lbs tongue weight

Using heavy duty Curt 14k lbs weight distribution system
- Observed about a 30% drop in tongue weight (from 708 down to 496) and (from 605 down to 424)

All of these measurements were taken when hooked up to my current Ram 3500, so will need to connect my trailer to the TRX and go to the measuring scales again to confirm it don't change much when using the TRX vs. my Ram 3500. Once I get my TRX and measure exact weights, I'll be sure to post and share so folks get an idea how the TRX responds with weight distribution system.

For me, the rule of thumb follows taking 10% of trailer weight as the tongue weight, then taking 30% off the tongue weight when using heavy duty weight distribution system.

All this conversation makes me so eager to get my new TRX and try all this out....

 

[1OF1ACR]

What are your thoughts on adding air bags? That's what I was thinking. Leave them empty during normal driving and put a set under there that doesn't compromise the suspension travel. I think the truck has the power, brakes and weight. It's just more of a payload concern.

Ha. should have watched the video first. I still think maybe a combo of bags and WD would be a plus.

 

[MAXGroup]

What are your thoughts on adding air bags? That's what I was thinking. Leave them empty during normal driving and put a set under there that doesn't compromise the suspension travel. I think the truck has the power and brakes, it's just more of a payload concern.

In a suspension such as the TRX air bags do not make sense, and also if you watched the vid it clearly shows that they do not take any weight off the rear axle and you are still riding with a heavy rear and a light front which is not ideal

 

[Futant]

What are your thoughts on adding air bags? That's what I was thinking. Leave them empty during normal driving and put a set under there that doesn't compromise the suspension travel. I think the truck has the power and brakes, it's just more of a payload concern.

Are you talk8ng about airbags in addition to the weigh distribution hitch?

 

[tkdr6]

What are your thoughts on adding air bags? That's what I was thinking. Leave them empty during normal driving and put a set under there that doesn't compromise the suspension travel. I think the truck has the power and brakes, it's just more of a payload concern.

Airbags will NOT help reduce trailer tongue weight like a weight distribution system does. Airbags will only reduce truck squat, but will often put even more tongue weight on the rear axles and often will still keep your frontend high which reduces steering and stability.

Please watch the video I shared above as it outlines in great detail the impact of using airbags vs. weight distribution system.

The video will help articulate with pictures vs. me explaining the differences and impacts in a long winded text response that will put folks asleep...

 

[tkdr6]

There have been times where I've used BOTH airbags and weight distribution system all working together.

The weight distribution system was used for redistributing tongue weight and for increased towing stability and reduced trailer sway. Then the airbags were used slightly to reduce squat as the weight distribution system wasn't able to get the trailer level properly.

Many folks use the airbags when NO trailer is connected, therefore a weight distribution system can't be used if no trailer is connected.

For example, you run down to the local Costco and buy a new kitchen appliance and put it in the back of your truck bed. The airbag system can help reduce squat, but still DOES NOT reduce any truck payload capability.

Hope this helps.

 

[MAXGroup]

There have been times where I've used BOTH airbags and weight distribution system all working together.

The weight distribution system was used for redistributing tongue weight and for increased towing stability and reduced trailer sway. Then the airbags were used slightly to reduce squat as the weight distribution system wasn't able to get the trailer level properly.

Many folks use the airbags when NO trailer is connected, therefore a weight distribution system can't be used if no trailer is connected.

For example, you run down to the local Costco and buy a new kitchen appliance and put it in the back of your truck bed. The airbag system can help reduce squat, but still DOES NOT reduce any truck payload capability.

Hope this helps.

I think it is important to remember that your entire suspension and axle is weight rated. You may level the truck but may exceed the weight rating on some part of your suspension, axle, or even tires...

 

[tkdr6]

I think it is important to remember that your entire suspension and axle is weight rated. You may level the truck but may exceed the weight rating on some part of your suspension, axle, or even tires...

Totally agree... never a good idea to exceed the manufacture weight ratings. These ratings will be listed inside the driver door panel per axle along with the GVWR

 

[Futant]

These are Dana 60’s. So I believe the entire tow limit is based on the suspension.

 

[tkdr6]

These are Dana 60’s. So I believe the entire tow limit is based on the suspension.

I would have to assume the same and agree with you. With the entire drive train and frame of the truck being upgraded, the suspension makes sense as the primary impediment of the payload

 

[1OF1ACR]

Yes. I'm talking about using both. If the weight rating is entirely because of the suspension (or maybe tires) then your just wanting to keep it from bottoming out. Which is where the bags would come into play. And then the weight distribution to stabilize the truck and get more weight on the front axles. I'm not saying to double the payload, but maybe at least add 200-300lbs. That makes a big difference in which trailer to go with. I have a Winnebago Ultralite that's 7000lbs dry and 800lb tongue. I will be going from a Ram 3500 to the TRX so I'm pretty maxed out and would like a little help using some tools.

 

[Futant]

Exactly, how does the airbags assist in the suspension arena?

 

[1OF1ACR]

Exactly, how does the airbags assist in the suspension arena?

Keeps the soft coils from bottoming out and stiffens the compression. Similar to an overload leaf or helper leaf on a heavy duty leaf spring pack.